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Six Cylinder Aero Bugatti(?) Mystery. (upd. Bug Type 18 radiator on Benz 200 HP?)
Thomas Erler sent us this interesting mystery photo which recently sold through the Austrian auctioneers Dorotheum.at . We see a massive chaindriven racing machine with a Bugatti like radiator with enlarged top tank. We can only speculate about the the machine depicted. The thick as a leg, high mounted exhaust manifold is attached to a colossal 6 in-line which suggests an aero engine or something of similar size. Possibly the driver and people nearby bring us closer to the solution? Thomas -and your editor no less- are most interested to hear from you.
Do you have a photo that you like to have identified? Let us know(click)
Gepubliceerd:
donderdag oktober 27th, 2011
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Reacties
Onbekend
11 November 2011, 08:27
There is a HUGE difference [in size] between a [small] T13 radiator [as per your heading] and a [large] T18 radiator as suggested by Gerhard Merz [#4] which would be far more likey. You only have to take the size of the radiator in scale to the rest of the car to see that there is no way it could be T13.
Lees verder
Onbekend
09 November 2011, 13:47
It doesn't look nothing like the Mefistofele. It's proportions are similar and all but that's it. First, it never had brakes on the front axle, second the axle is too close to the radiator and third, why would it have a french licence plate?
One thing looks clear to me: it's not a 6-cylindre engine under the hood, it's a 4-banger. I'd be more inclined towards the Benz 200HP chassis, although that didn't have front brakes either and the wheelbase looks longer...
Lees verder
One thing looks clear to me: it's not a 6-cylindre engine under the hood, it's a 4-banger. I'd be more inclined towards the Benz 200HP chassis, although that didn't have front brakes either and the wheelbase looks longer...
Onbekend
04 November 2011, 05:42
Could this be Mephistopheles in it early trim ???? as it did have a 4 cylinder engine in its early life up to 1920`s
Have a look in Octane issue 100 , the chassis look very alike
hope this helps
Lees verder
Have a look in Octane issue 100 , the chassis look very alike
hope this helps
Onbekend
30 October 2011, 18:11
The car might be the first racecar of count zborowski: a 24 litres six Maybach engine in a Mercedes chassis.
Lees verder
Onbekend
30 October 2011, 18:03
The man in the black suit is possibly count Zborowski.
Lees verder
Onbekend
29 October 2011, 22:37
I agree with Richard Armstrong - it must be a Benz 200hp chassis. The rivets along the side correspond with those illustrated in Ch 6 of Boddy's book Brooklands Giants. The chain wheel is smaller than those of the Brooklands cars; maybe this is attending a hillclimb? A frontal accident was probably responsible for substitute axle and radiator. They had form: one went over the top at Brooklands due to a lack of brakes, and Zborowski broke his up after deciding it was too dangerous to race (even for him!).
Lees verder
Onbekend
29 October 2011, 15:19
L.S. The man with the hat, holding the steeringwheel wiuth his hand: isn't that Jean Bugatti?
Georges van Zeijl
Lees verder
Georges van Zeijl
Onbekend
29 October 2011, 12:06
With four openings i agree but about the fth i'm not shure. Could it be that what looks like the fith opening is the upper end of the vent ribs?
Lees verder
Onbekend
29 October 2011, 11:30
The car has a pre-1928 French registration plate: xxxx-M2 (‘arrondissement Marseille’ in southeastern France; compare http://plaque.free.fr/f_rec2e.html)
Lees verder
Onbekend
29 October 2011, 09:02
I don't know the car, six branch manifold suggests 6 cylindre something, and big. But look at the people, how miserable do they look? Have their Mothers collectively shouted 'That's it ,boys, put it away, time to come in for your tea'?
Editor: Regarding the number of cylinders; I see at least 5 openings in the bonnet, about number 6 I am not sure. Could a big four have a 5 opening manifold?
Lees verder
Editor: Regarding the number of cylinders; I see at least 5 openings in the bonnet, about number 6 I am not sure. Could a big four have a 5 opening manifold?
Onbekend
29 October 2011, 06:46
I agree with Richard Armstrong, it isn’t necessarily a sraight six engine. I think it has to be a straight konfiguraiton, because the bonnet is too small for a V-engine. So it has to be a straight four or six engine.
The chassis could be from a Benz 200HP but the front end seems to be smaler than the one of the Benz. And what irritates me, is, that the car has brakes on the front axle.
The radiator could be from a Bugatti T18, i think the dimensions are similar.
Perhaps it is the Benz 200HP wich was optimised a little bit. Maybe after a crash? The picture seems to be from the late 20ies or 30ies because the roof of car in the background looks like this period. So it is possible that the car was converted a little bit during the Time. I don’t know.
Lees verder
The chassis could be from a Benz 200HP but the front end seems to be smaler than the one of the Benz. And what irritates me, is, that the car has brakes on the front axle.
The radiator could be from a Bugatti T18, i think the dimensions are similar.
Perhaps it is the Benz 200HP wich was optimised a little bit. Maybe after a crash? The picture seems to be from the late 20ies or 30ies because the roof of car in the background looks like this period. So it is possible that the car was converted a little bit during the Time. I don’t know.
Onbekend
28 October 2011, 19:25
It seems to be very similar to the big aero-engined Mephistopheles-style Fiat special which was offered for sale recently?
Lees verder
Onbekend
28 October 2011, 15:34
looks to big to be a Brescia rad though shape is very simmilar?
Lees verder
Onbekend
28 October 2011, 14:41
I don't see any direct evidence of it being a six and it looks like a Benz 200HP to me: possibly the rather mysterious fifth chassis which - according to Karl Ludvigsen's "Quicksilver Century" - competed in various forms both before and after the Great War but doesn't seem to have been photographed much.
Lees verder